later: Mr. VALENCIA RODRIGUEZ
Consideration of reports, comments and information submitted by States parties under article 9 of the Convention (continued)
Eleventh and twelfth periodic reports of Ecuador (continued)
Periodic report of the Central African Republic
Other business
Second Decade to Combat Racism and Racial Discrimination
CONSIDERATION OF REPORTS, COMMENTS AND INFORMATION SUBMITTED BY STATES PARTIES UNDER ARTICLE 9 OF THE CONVENTION (agenda item 4) (continued)
Eleventh and twelfth periodic reports of Ecuador (CERD/C/197/Add.9, CERD/C/226/Add.1 and HRI/CORE/1/Add.7) (continued)
1. The CHAIRMAN invited the delegation of Ecuador to answer the questions the members of the Committee had asked at the preceding meeting.
2. Mr. PINOARGOTE CEVALLOS (Ecuador) said that, a few weeks previously, he had asked his Government for additional information which he had, unfortunately, not yet received. In his view, the accuracy of a report was an essential quality. As far as human rights were concerned, it was too frequently the case that general statements were made, but what had to be seen was what was actually happening in terms of legislative measures and in practice. He assured the Committee that he would urge his Government to include specific answers to the questions asked at the current session in its next report. For the time being, he would try to answer some of those questions.
3. He had been among those who had worked on the current constitutional reform and he could therefore speak about it on the basis of experience. He noted in passing that Ecuador was on its seventeenth Constitution. That showed that the earlier Constitutions had not been very adaptable. One of the elements of the current reform, which related to the judiciary, was the establishment of the post of an ombudsman. Some had regarded that idea as rather exotic, but it had been clearly explained by the media. Until now, human rights questions had been within the jurisdiction of the Prosecutor General, but in fact they involved various departments and that created red tape. The existence of an ombudsman would simplify procedures. The constitutional reform was also designed to prevent the judiciary from falling into the hands of a political party. Other explanations on the content of that reform would be given in Ecuador's next periodic report.
4. With regard to the representation of indigenous peoples, the 1945 Constitution had allowed them to have a representative in Congress, like certain professions. That system had not worked well and it had been abandoned. The seventeenth Constitution would not provide for representation of that kind: all representatives would continue to be elected by the people, without any consideration as to culture or race. The question of indigenous peoples did not arise in that way in Ecuador. The country did not have any practices of racial discrimination similar to apartheid. Differences were, rather, economic and there were few indigenous persons among the wealthy.
5. Referring to the indigenous uprisings that had taken place in 1990, he said that the situation since then had been characterized by an ongoing dialogue between the State and indigenous communities, which had submitted a list of 16 grievances. One basic point was the allocation to the indigenous communities not only of land, but also of the means of working it. For the time being, the dialogue was keeping the peace, since there had been no more uprisings, but the problems that arose dated back several centuries and the solution to them would take a long time.
6. In reply to a question concerning the treatment of court cases in his country, he gave a personal example. About one year previously, when he had been the editor of the largest newspaper in the country, he had been the victim of an attack. The police had done its work well and he had had one of the best lawyers in the country, who had been hired by his newspaper. His case, which had been conducted in very favourable conditions, had, however, still not been decided. That example proved that indigenous peoples and other underprivileged categories were not the only victims of slowness in the administration of justice. The case of the Restrepo brothers was well under way, but still going on. It was very helpful if the Committee requested information on the progress of such cases, for that created outside pressure that could speed up their settlement.
7. In connection with the exploitation of resources on land belonging to indigenous peoples, he said that the President of the Republic was personally studying the effects of oil exploration in the Amazon on the environment and on indigenous peoples and was trying to guarantee the protection of the environment by modern methods. Of course, Ecuador, a debt-ridden country which did not receive enough support from multilateral financing institutions, had to exploit its oil in order to have enough money for programmes for the benefit of the poor. Such exploitation could, however, take place at the same time as protection of the environment and the interests of indigenous peoples. According to Ecuadorian legislation, the State owned the subsoil, but had to exploit its resources by providing appropriate compensation for indigenous communities, especially the Huaoranis, a population which lived in the Stone Age and was not at all integrated in western civilization, like the Yanomamis in Brazil, but with fewer members: 2,715 persons, as against 20,000.
8. He assured the members of the Committee that he would recommend that his Government should communicate the information requested and thanked them for the dynamic interest they showed in his country. Although some information might still be missing, it should not be concluded that there was any lack of willingness on Ecuador's part as far as human rights were concerned.
9. Mr. van BOVEN welcomed the fact that the representative of Ecuador had announced that additional information would be included in his country's next report. He thanked him for his statements and for his country's willingness to engage in a dialogue.
10. Mr. WOLFRUM said that he agreed with Mr. van Boven's comments. He had noted that the representative of Ecuador had stated that there was no racial discrimination in his country, for the use of beaches for example. That was certainly true, but attention must be drawn to more subtle forms of discrimination. For instance, if a particular community depended for its survival on a sound environment, it had to be protected against the deterioration of that environment by forestry, mining and other activities. If one community was thus affected more than other segments of the population, it had to be considered that some form of racial discrimination existed.
11. Mr. YUTZIS said that he shared Mr. Wolfrum's concern. As to the statement by the representative of Ecuador that there was no discrimination in his country, he assured him that the Committee was not thinking of systematic discrimination, but of more subtle forms. Over the years, the reports of Latin American countries which were States parties to the Convention had shown that discrimination in those countries was not openly racial, but did have an economic basis. What was involved was thus a class system in which the rationalization of the economy affected the indigenous communities most.
12. Mr. ABOUL-NASR said that any development project, whether for oil exploration or the construction of a dam, had adverse consequences for some persons. In Egypt, for example, the construction of the Aswan Dam had required the displacement of the Nubian population, which had been living for thousands of years on land that was now under water. That population had been resettled elsewhere. Could one speak of racial discrimination in such a case? He did not think so. He also did not think that the protection of the environment, to which reference was increasingly being made, had anything to do with racial discrimination, unless, of course, nothing was done for indigenous peoples whose environment was altered.
13. Mr. RECHETOV commended the Ecuadorian Government on the efforts it was making to protect human rights and create a society in which the traditions and cultures of the various components of the population would be respected.
14. In the case of major construction work, account should be taken not only of the significance it would have for the country as a whole, but also of the effects it might have on the populations directly concerned. A few years previously in the Soviet Union, for example, there had been some question of diverting rivers in Siberia in order to develop the region. The authors of that project had, however, not given enough thought to the effects it might have on location populations. As a famous academician had said at the time, it was not normal for a bureaucrat in Moscow to be able, with one stroke of the pen, to change people's environment and lives without consulting them first.
15. The world, like Ecuador, was all the richer for the diversity of its culture, which had to be preserved, even if that did not always make sense in economic terms.
16. Mr. de GOUTTES said that construction work could sometimes be an indirect way of discriminating against certain population groups, particularly indigenous ones, which usually could not put up much resistance. That question should therefore be considered in greater detail by the Committee.
17. Paragraph 45 of the twelfth report (CERD/C/226/Add.1) stated that oil exploration companies had to carry out environmental impact studies and submit a management plan describing the measures to be taken to minimize the adverse effects of project execution. However, paragraph 47 stated that the biggest oil exploration companies belonged to Texaco, whose activities had been undertaken without any environmental impact study, which had been made a requirement only in 1985. That exception was thus a matter of great concern.
18. Mr. WOLFRUM said that there was no question of agreeing that a small group might be able to hold up the execution of a project of great importance for the entire country, but only of considering problems on a case-by-case basis and of always taking account of the aspirations of the indigenous peoples whose environment would be altered by such a project. The problem was not only a financial one. He had asked some Hopi Indians why they refused to allow the subsoil of their reservation to be explored and they had replied that their religion prohibited such exploration and that they preferred to stay poor rather than contravene that prohibition.
19. Mr. van BOVEN said it was good that the Ecuadorian Government had drawn the Committee's attention to the effects that development projects might have on the environment and indigenous peoples. Perhaps the Committee could take part in the International Year for the World's Indigenous People by drafting a declaration or a general recommendation containing some general principles on that question.
20. Mr. RECHETOV said that he agreed with the views expressed by Mr. van Boven and that the proposed document might be entitled "economic development and rights of indigenous peoples". It would be addressed not only to Governments, but also to the peoples concerned, who would thus be aware that some legal and moral rules had to be respected and that such rules would take precedence over purely economic considerations.
21. Mr. LAMPTEY said that he did not agree with the direction the debate was taking, since the Committee seemed to be adopting a very militant attitude and to be dealing with very complex problems that did not really relate to racial discrimination.
22. In Ghana, the Akosombo Dam on the Volta had been and continued to be criticized in the developed countries, whose populations had a high standard of living and which used most of the resources of the rest of the world. However, that dam was vital for the economy of the country. Some persons had, of course, been affected by its construction, but on the whole, it had improved the situation of the population.
23. The Committee must not look backwards on the pretext of protecting the environment. If nothing had been done, people would still be living in the Stone Age. In conclusion, he said that all those questions were extremely sensitive and that there was no consensus on them. The Committee therefore had to approach them cautiously and, in any event, not make any general recommendations in connection with them.
24. Mr. FERRERO COSTA commended the Government of Ecuador on having raised the question of the relationship between the rights of indigenous peoples and the use of natural resources, which was a matter of concern to other countries in Latin America and elsewhere. He found Mr. van Boven's proposal very interesting. He agreed with Mr. Lamptey that the question was very complex, but he thought that the Committee had to deal with it because it did relate to racial discrimination. The document proposed by Mr. van Boven might also form part of the Committee's contribution to the World Conference on Human Rights.
25. He thanked Mrs. Sadiq Ali for having distributed the summary of the report of the Sub-Commission's Working Group on Indigenous Populations (E/CN.4/Sub.2/1992/33 and Add.1). The Committee should take account of the work of that Working Group when it considered the question of indigenous populations from the point of view of racial discrimination. Like other speakers, he welcomed the fact that the question of indigenous populations had been raised in connection with the consideration of the report of Ecuador, thus giving the Committee an opportunity to consider a question that went far beyond the context of that country.
26. Mr. Lamptey had worried about the "activist" tendency that might lead the Committee to deal with difficult and complex issues going beyond its mandate. In his own view, the Committee had one main function, which was to consider reports submitted by States and complaints by individuals, but that must not prevent it from dealing with more general problems linked to its main objective of eliminating racial discrimination. That was, moreover, the trend now taking shape in all international human rights treaty monitoring bodies. He therefore supported Mr. van Boven's proposal.
27. The CHAIRMAN, noting that the Committee was considering more than one question at a time, requested the members to deal only with the consideration of the report of Ecuador for the moment.
28. Mr. SHAHI pointed out that the current discussion had been triggered by the report of Ecuador. The Committee's consideration of the effects of economic development on indigenous peoples was, moreover, justified by some provisions of the Convention, such as article 1, paragraph 4, and article 2, paragraph 2. Mr. Lamptey had referred to the example of the construction of a dam in Ghana, but he himself did not think that that dam had had any consequences for any particular racial or ethnic group. In his view, the land question was especially important for indigenous peoples: there was a kind of "mystical link" between those peoples and their land and it was reflected in collective ownership. In order to preserve that link and prevent the land from being taken away from the indigenous peoples, the Convention provided for and authorized special measures amounting to "positive discrimination".
29. Mr. PINOARGOTE CEVALLOS (Ecuador) welcomed the fact that his country's report had given rise to the current discussion. In future, it would be helpful for his Government to have a general recommendation by the Committee on the question of indigenous populations.
30. The Petroecuador-Texaco consortium referred to in paragraph 47 of the report had ceased to exist in 1992. At present, there was only the Petroecuador Company, which depended on the Ecuadorian Government and, in particular, the Office of the Under-Secretary for the Environment in the Ministry of Energy and Mines.
31. The CHAIRMAN thanked the delegation of Ecuador for introducing the report of its country and providing additional information.
32. The delegation of Ecuador withdrew.
33. Mr. Valencia Rodriguez took the Chair.
34. Mrs. SADIQ ALI (Country Rapporteur) said that the Committee was considering the implementation of the Convention in the Central African Republic in the absence of a representative of the Government and in the absence of a report. The fourth, fifth and sixth periodic reports of the Central African Republic had been submitted in one document (CERD/C/90/Add.10) in 1984 and had covered the period of the despotic Bokassa Government and the period following Bokassa's overthrow on by General Kolingba on 1 September 1981 in a bloodless coup that had had the backing of the military. The seventh periodic report of the Central African Republic had been due on 14 April 1984.
35. The Central African Republic was a landlocked country which had much in common with the neighbouring countries, Cameroon, Chad, Congo, Sudan and Zaire. The inhabitants of each part of the country had links with groups on the other side of the border. The population of that entire part of the world had been decimated for centuries by the slave trade, invasions from nearby kingdoms, foreign imperialism and forced labour. There were about 80 ethnic groups in the Central African Republic.
36. The earliest inhabitants of the Central African Republic had been the Pygmies, known by Bantu speakers as Babinga. At present, the Baya and Banda people accounted for nearly half of the total population, which had been estimated at 1.92 million in 1900. Other prominent groups were the Baka and the Zanda.
37. As far as religion was concerned, 60 per cent of the population was animist, 25 per cent Catholic, 6 per cent Protestant and 9 per cent Muslim.
38. French was the official language and Sango was also a major language. Swahili was used in the east, Arabic in the north and Hausa among traders.
39. In 1986, General Kolingba had been elected President for a six-year term and a Constitution had been adopted establishing a National Assembly. The following year, the Central African Democratic Assembly Party (RDC) had been formed as the sole legal party. Faced with growing discontent, General Kolingba had announced in April 1991 that other parties, legally registered by the Ministry of the Interior, could compete with the RDC in the legislative elections in March 1992 and the presidential elections in November 1992.
40. Sections of the ruling party had also begun to criticize official policy, according to the Africa Research Bulletin (Political Series, vol. 28, No. 6, June 1991, p. 1017), which quoted a report by the RDC Steering Committee referring to the "discrimination that has been inflaming public sentiment and fueling ethnic dissension". It was also noted in that article that the administrative committee and parastatal organizations had become the domain of one ethnic group, an allusion to President Kolingba's entourage, which was composed mainly of Yakomas, "who make up less than 5 per cent of the population".
41. The right of private citizens to speak publicly about political developments or to criticize the Government was circumscribed. Newspapers and the media were all controlled by the Government and academic freedom was limited. Teachers had gone on strike to force the Government to bring about political reform.
42. In 1991, the Ministry of Justice had taken several steps to check growing judicial independence; it had created the post of Inspector General charged with the oversight of justice and had removed the President of the Supreme Court.
43. In the great National Debate in 1992, delegates had approved a revision of the Constitution which would set up a semi-presidential regime with strict separation of the executive, legislative and judicial powers. However, the presidential elections had been cancelled in November 1992 as a result of irregularities in the October polls. No new date had been set.
44. During the consideration of the last report, the Committee had expressed the hope that the Government of the Central African Republic would provide detailed information on the implementation of the provisions of the Convention and include the relevant legislative texts. That request was now being reiterated.
45. The revised Constitution should also guarantee respect for human rights and the principle of the equality of all under the law. During the consideration of the seventh report, the Committee had pointed out that, in practice, some minorities did not receive equal treatment. The forest-dwelling Bayaka, or Pygmies, were subjected to discrimination and exploitation, which the Government had done little to correct. Pygmies were often hired by villagers to work for wages much lower than those received by other groups. Muslims, particularly Mbororo (Peuhl) herders, were sometimes resented by other Central Africans for their affluence and were thus singled out for harassment, especially by the police. There were few Muslims in senior Government posts.
46. It would also be useful to know how the judicial system operated and whether civil and criminal legislation was in force.
47. In the context of article 2 of the Convention, the Committee had noted that the practice of recording the ethnic origin of children, which had been prevalent in the Central African Republic, had been abolished in 1975. Under general recommendation IV, however, information on the demographic composition of the population, as referred to in article 1 of the Convention, was essential.
48. The Committee would also like to have information on the socio-economic situation of various ethnic groups and on what was being done to implement article 1, paragraph 4, and article 2, paragraph 2, of the Convention, especially to improve the living conditions of the Pygmies.
49. It wished to know whether the Government recognized and protected the right of minorities to have their own language and develop their own culture and what specific measures had been taken for that purpose.
50. The next report could usefully indicate, in connection with article 2, paragraph 1 (e), of the Convention, whether there were any integrationist multiracial organizations or non-governmental human rights organizations working to promote racial equality.
51. With regard to the implementation of article 4 of the Convention, the Committee again expressed the hope that the Government would take appropriate measures to fill the gaps in its legislation concerning the incorporation of the provisions of that article into domestic law.
52. The Committee also wished to have additional information on how Central African legislation corresponded to article 5 of the Convention.
53. The Committee had asked what legislative measures had been adopted by the Government to protect refugees and to implement a policy of granting asylum. In late 1991, over 50,000 Sudanese had fled civil strife in their country to seek safe haven in the remote south-eastern corner of the Central African Republic. According to reports, the Central African Government had appealed for emergency aid to help with the refugee influx.
54. The conflict in Chad had caused constant anxiety for the Central African Republic. Many Chadians had crossed the border in the northern part of the country, where it was feared that they might act as a catalyst for discontent among their fellow Sara tribesmen. According to the Office of the United Nations High Commissioner for Refugees, 30,000 Chadians had entered the Central African Republic. The Government was not prepared to leave them in the northern area adjacent to Chad, since they might decide to take up permanent residence alongside their fellow Sara tribesmen.
55. With regard to article 6 of the Convention, the Committee had requested information on the right of recourse and on whether local or customary law encouraged recourse to conciliation in cases of racial discrimination. The Committee had also stressed the importance of providing information on the measures taken in the fields of education, training, culture and information under article 7 of the Convention.
56. In the past nine years, changes had taken place in the Central African Republic and the country had adopted a new Constitution, but the presidential elections had been postponed and a constitutional vacuum might occur. The last report did not contain satisfactory replies on the implementation of the articles of the Convention. It would therefore be necessary to send the State party a new communication, accompanied by the summary records of the meetings the Committee had devoted at its current and preceding sessions to the consideration of the situation in the Central African Republic, requesting information about constitutional and other developments relating to ethnic problems.
57. Lastly, she noted that the Committee had also drawn the State party's attention to the possibility of requesting the Centre for Human Rights to provide it with technical assistance to help it prepare reports for international human rights treaty monitoring bodies.
58. Mr. de GOUTTES thanked Mrs. Sadiq Ali for having drawn attention to all the questions that had not been answered in the preceding report and letting the Government of the Central African Republic know what information it should give the Committee in its next report. The last available report, the seventh (CERD/C/117/Add.5), was totally obsolete. It dated from 1985 and had already been incomplete at the time. At the 1986 session, all members of the Committee had said how inadequate the report was. The Committee therefore had to ask for a new and entirely revised report based on the Committee's reporting guidelines. There were three main points on which the Committee had to ask for further information. First of all, what recent developments had taken place in the country from the political, economic and social points of view? What was happening with the planned elections? What had happened to the National Conference? Was headway being made towards a pluralist democracy? What about the amendment of the Constitution? Secondly, what was the demographic composition of the population and what were the exact numbers for each group, especially the Pygmy population? Thirdly, the Committee had to ask for copies of texts making racial discrimination an offence (art. 4 of the Convention) and, in particular, for data on the implementation of those texts.
59. Mr. ABOUL-NASR thanked Mrs. Sadiq Ali and said that he agreed with Mr. de Gouttes. He proposed that the Secretariat should send the Permanent Mission of the Central African Republic to the United Nations a summary of the statements by Mrs. Sadiq Ali and Mr. de Gouttes and let it know how much it deplored the fact that the Central African Republic was disregarding its obligations under the Convention.
60. Mr. van BOVEN said that he fully supported the statement by Mr. Aboul-Nasr. He proposed that the Committee should bring a list of all the States parties that were flagrantly disregarding their obligations under the Convention to the attention not only of the General Assembly, but also of the meeting of States parties to the Convention. As far as he knew, the next meeting of States parties, which was held every year, was to take place in January 1994.
61. Mr. DIACONU said that he was in favour of the proposals by Mr. Aboul-Nasr and Mr. van Boven.
62. Mr. FERRERO COSTA said that he also supported the two proposals. With regard to the second one, he said that the list to be sent to the meeting of States parties should refer to the member States which were really flagrantly disregarding the Committee's work.
63. Mr. ABOUL-NASR proposed that the Committee's decision on the question of the communication to be sent to the meeting of States parties should be taken at its next session.
64. Mr. DIACONU drew the Committee's attention to the situation of poor countries, such as the Central African Republic, which might not have the material means to prepare reports that involved work by several ministries, national institutes, non-governmental organizations and universities. If such countries had not fulfilled their obligations, the United Nations might offer them advisory services and help them train teams to prepare their reports.
65. Mr. ABOUL-NASR said that decisions had already been taken along those lines and that member States had been informed of the assistance they could obtain from the Centre for Human Rights for the preparation of reports. The question under consideration was not the problems that countries faced, but the interest they showed in the Committee's work.
66. Mr. de GOUTTES said that, like Mr. Diaconu, he was aware that some countries had problems preparing their reports. In the letter it would send to the Central African Republic, however, the Committee had to state that it deplored the absence of a delegation from that country during the consideration of its report and the fact that it had not come forward at all. It should also remind the Government of the Central African Republic that, if it wished, it could receive advisory services assistance from the Centre for Human Rights and that the Committee was at its disposal to help it prepare its reports.
67. Mr. GARVALOV said that the Committee had already dealt with other countries in that way and that it was time for it to adopt a firmer stance. It might thus indicate in its annual report that, by not submitting reports or by submitting them late, some States parties not only did not fulfil their obligations under the Convention, but also hampered the Committee's work in combating racial discrimination at the world level.
68. The CHAIRMAN suggested that the letter to be sent to the Permanent Mission of the Central African Republic should reflect the opinions expressed by the members of the Committee during the consideration of that country's report and that the question of the communication to be sent to the meeting of States parties should be considered at the Committee's next session.
69. It was so decided.
OTHER BUSINESS
70. The CHAIRMAN said that, on the previous day, the Bureau had adopted a draft letter to be sent to the President of the Commission on Human Rights concerning the Committee's willingness to cooperate fully with the Special Rapporteur appointed by the Commission to consider the question of contemporary forms of racism, racial discrimination and xenophobia and related intolerance (E/CN.4/1993/L.20/Rev.1, para. 10).
71. Mr. ABOUL-NASR proposed that, in the second sentence of the last paragraph of the letter, the words "In particular, the Committee places on record that it stands ready to" should be replaced by the words "In particular, the Committee expresses its readiness to".
72. Mr. WOLFRUM said it was regrettable that the Commission on Human Rights had considered that matter without first consulting the Committee.
73. The CHAIRMAN suggested that the Committee should adopt the draft letter with the amendment proposed by Mr. Aboul-Nasr.
74. It was so decided.
75. The CHAIRMAN said that the Committee might send a draft letter to the Ministers for Foreign Affairs of Bosnia and Herzegovina, Croatia, Slovenia, the Federal Republic of Yugoslavia (Serbia and Montenegro), the Czech Republic, the Slovak Republic and the States of the former Soviet Union which were not yet parties to the Convention concerning the status of those countries in relation to the Committee.
76. Mr. ABOUL-NASR said that he was not in favour of such a step.
77. Mr. BANTON said that he understood Mr. Aboul-Nasr's reticence.
78. Mr. FERRERO COSTA proposed that the consideration of that question should be deferred until a later meeting.
79. Mr. LAMPTEY said that the Committee had no authority to send communications to States requiring them to assume obligations under the Convention.
80. The CHAIRMAN suggested that the consideration of that question should be deferred.
81. It was so decided.
SECOND DECADE TO COMBAT RACISM AND RACIAL DISCRIMINATION (agenda item 7) (General Assembly resolution 47/77, E/CN.4/1993/L.9 and A/47/434)
82. Mr. BANTON, introducing agenda item 7, drew the attention of the members of the Committee to paragraphs 9, 22 and 23 of General Assembly resolution 47/77 and to paragraph 19 and sections I and II of the annex to document E/CN.4/1993/L.9 entitled "Activities recommended for inclusion in the draft programme of action for the third decade to combat racism and racial discrimination".