UNITED

NATIONS

                                                                                                                                     Distr.

                                                                                                                                     GENERAL

                                                                                                                                     CEDAW/C/SR.239

                                                                                                                                     4 February 1994

                                                                                                                                     ORIGINAL: ENGLISH

COMMITTEE ON THE ELIMINATION OF DISCRIMINATION AGAINST WOMEN

Thirteenth session

SUMMARY RECORD OF THE 239th MEETING

Held at Headquarters, New York,

on Thursday, 20 January 1994, at 3 p.m.

Chairperson: Ms. CORTI

CONTENTS

Consideration of reports submitted by States parties under article 18 of the Convention (continued)

          This record is subject to correction. Corrections should be sent under the signature of a member of the delegation concerned within one week of the date of the publication to the Chief of the Official Records Editing Section, room DC2-794, 2 United Nations Plaza, and incorporated in a copy of the record.

          Corrections will be issued after the end of the session, in a separate corrigendum for each Committee.

94-80137 (E)                                                                                                                                                /...

The meeting was called to order at 3.15 p.m.

CONSIDERATION OF REPORTS SUBMITTED BY STATES PARTIES UNDER ARTICLE 18 OF THE CONVENTION (continued)

Initial report of the Netherlands (continued) (CEDAW/C/NET/1 and Add.1-3)

1.       At the invitation of the Chairperson, Ms. Bode-Olton, Ms. Hoevertsz and Ms. Swiebel (Netherlands) took places at the Committee table.

2.       Ms. BODE-OLTON (Netherlands), representing the Netherlands Antilles, replying to the Committee's questions with regard to the functioning of the national machinery for bringing women's rights into the mainstream in the Netherlands Antilles, said that it had been established in 1989 under the oversight of the Minister for General Affairs, who was also the Prime Minister. Although its status had not yet been legally formalized, it had succeeded in creating greater awareness of women's rights.

3.       In 1992, the Government had organized an extensive workshop on human rights and reporting procedures, which had focused on four major human rights instruments including the Convention on the Elimination of All Forms of Discrimination against Women. The participants had been mainly civil servants and members of the judiciary and police forces of the different islands.

4.       Policy-making in the Netherlands Antilles was hampered by lack of statistical data, due, inter alia, to lack of standardization and inadequate funding. The situation was further complicated by the fact that the Netherlands Antilles comprised five islands, each with its own specific needs and characteristics. Vulnerability to external economic forces and the effects of heavy immigration on the social and political structures, however, concerned the community as a whole and women in particular. The Government had therefore established a special unit to undertake population studies and to prepare a draft policy plan for women and development.

5.       As for the number of women deputies in Parliament, latest available data showed that women accounted for 13 per cent of the total number of deputies and 30 per cent of government ministers. The Prime Minister was also a woman.

6.       On the question of the relationship between the low minimum age for marriage by women and the rate of divorce, she said that although article 78 of the Civil Code of the Netherlands Antilles laid down a minimum age of 15 years for marriage by women, in fact few women married at that age, preferring to complete their education and to embark on a career. Moreover, a multidisciplinary commission was currently engaged in a comprehensive review of the Code. She acknowledged that divorce was common.

(Ms. Bode-Olton, Netherlands)

7.       Women in the Netherlands Antilles were increasingly being empowered in all areas, as demonstrated by the fact that women had accounted for 65 per cent of participants at a recent training programme for small business owners.

8.       Ms. HOEVERTSZ (Netherlands), representing Aruba, said that the Government proposed to make specific presentations on the subject of human rights to students at the police academy and to correctional and immigration personnel. In addition, the Universal Declaration of Human Rights and the Convention on the Rights of the Child had already been translated into Papiamento and disseminated throughout the community.

9.       With regard to the national machinery in Aruba, the Government had appointed a focal point for women's affairs within the Directorate of Social Affairs in 1986; however, an integral and interdepartmental emancipation policy had yet to be developed.

10.     Sexual abuse of women and children remained a very sensitive area of concern. In Aruba, as in many other countries, sexual offences and related crimes constituted a considerable part of the police department's total workload. A private foundation, "Fundoción Respetami", comprising professionals working in the area of child welfare had been established in 1991 in order to held children who were victims of such crimes. Adult victims of abuse could seek redress through the courts or through the Bureau of Family Difficulties of the Directorate of Social Affairs. The "Respetami" Foundation also hoped to establish self-help groups for those victims in the near future.

11.     On the subject of dismissal on the grounds of pregnancy, she said that private sector employees were governed by two main laws, the first being the Landordinance on the Termination of Labour Contracts, which provided that employers must obtain the prior approval of the Director of the Department of Labour in order to terminate a labour contract. In practice, pregnancy was never considered to be sufficient grounds for granting such permission. The second law was the Aruban Civil Code, which prohibited dismissal in cases of sickness or accident. Although pregnancy was not explicitly mentioned it was considered to be covered under "sickness" as was true of the social security laws under which a pregnant employee was entitled to social benefits. Government employees were covered by the Landordinance governing Substantive Public Service Law.

12.     Despite those provisions, however, some cases of dismissal on account of pregnancy had occurred in the private sector. In its judgement of 24 June 1992, the Court of First Instance of Aruba had ruled that the stipulation in the labour contract between Air Aruba and its employees to the effect that pregnancy constituted grounds for termination of employment was manifestly unreasonable and that, since only women could be dismissed on grounds of pregnancy, it

(Ms. Hoevertsz, Netherlands)

constituted direct discrimination on grounds of sex and was therefore invalid. In cases of manifestly unreasonable dismissal, a judge could grant damages to or order the reinstatement of an employee.

13.     Available data showed that the rate of AIDS infection in Aruba was relatively low, but was steadily increasing. Men accounted for approximately 60 per cent of HIV-positive cases. Transmission was mainly due to heterosexual contact and Arubans and foreigners living in Aruba were affected in equal numbers. A national AIDS commission had been established in Aruba in 1987 to provide clinical care and counselling to AIDS patients and HIV-positive individuals and to institute control methods, including health education and epidemiological surveillance. Health education activities included regular television broadcasts and the nationwide distribution of posters and leaflets. Large numbers of condoms were also distributed to vulnerable groups, such as prostitutes. The latter received, in addition, special guidance and counselling; before receiving their work permits they were obliged to report to the infectious diseases unit of the Department of Public Health and they had to submit to periodic checkups. The results of those efforts would only become known over the long term.

14.     Ms. SWIEBEL (Netherlands), replying to the questions, said that the national machinery in the Netherlands was a complex of various institutions comprising the State Secretary of Social Affairs and Employment, who had main political responsibility and was the core of the national machinery, the Department for the Coordination of Emancipation Policy, which had responsibility at the administrative level, and the Emancipation Council and the Equal Opportunities Commission, both of which were semi-independent agencies which fulfilled the specific roles assigned to them through legislative mandates. The main task of the core national machinery was to mobilize public concern about women's issues in order to keep them high on the political agenda and to achieve workable policy solutions. Efforts were also being made to encourage other levels of Government to take up those issues.

15.     The Government appreciated the report entitled "Showpiece or slow coach" submitted by one of the non-governmental organizations which, in counter-balancing the official report submitted to the Committee, accurately reflected the relationship between the Government and private voluntary organizations in the Netherlands. While her Government placed great value on the distribution of power and responsibilities, it remained wholly accountable to Parliament for its policy decisions and budget expenditures. Non-governmental organizations were responsible only to their respective constituencies and could criticize or question government policies. The Government considered the presence of independent non-governmental organizations which reflected the interests of the public to be a major asset in a democratic

(Ms. Swiebel, Netherlands)

society and was therefore willing to contribute financially to their functioning.

16.     For their part, equality policies in the Netherlands were based on a strategy of integrating women's issues into all areas and levels of policy making. The Government hoped that the new monitoring methodologies to be developed by the national machinery would be able to measure the concrete results of that type of indirect action.

17.     She had taken careful note of the observations by members of the Committee concerning the lack of analysis in the report. She pointed out that inputs to the report had come from different parts of the administration and that it had been difficult to follow the Committee's guidelines without losing sight of the Government's own policy priorities.

18.     Promotion of women's economic self-reliance was a major policy objective of the Government and, in 1981, political responsibility for equality issues had been transferred from the Ministry of Welfare to the Ministry of Social Affairs and Employment.

19.     Replying to questions under article 2 concerning the legal protection of the rights of women against discrimination, she reported that the Equal Opportunities Act had been invoked in nearly 50 cases in court since its revision in 1989. Most of the cases had been dealt with by the Equal Employment Opportunities Commission, which was a semi-judicial body. The new provisions of the criminal code on sex discrimination had recently come into force and the General Equal Opportunities Act was expected to become law in 1994.

20.     The NGO report "Showpiece or slow coach" stated that the new guidelines for public prosecution concerning cases of discrimination were not sufficiently clear. The Government of the Netherlands had confirmed that, following the entry into force of the Equal Opportunities Act, the Guidelines would be reviewed and clarified.

21.     Responding to the question of what was meant by "horizontal relationships", she said that they referred to relationships between citizens, as opposed to the "vertical relationship" between citizens and the State. In the Netherlands, the State was bound to always respect the fundamental rights and freedoms of its citizens. There was some debate, however, as to whether citizens were obliged to respect each other's fundamental rights and freedoms, particularly where the latter were in conflict with each other. One of the main aims of anti-discrimination legislation was to determine in which cases citizens were obliged to respect the fundamental rights of their fellow citizens and in which others they might follow their own convictions.

(Ms. Swiebel, Netherlands)

22.     On the subject of sexual violence against women and girls, the Government of the Netherlands proposed to undertake a study of the effects of government policy on violence against women. In 1993, approximately US$ 40 million had been spent on combating such violence. The relevant legislation had been amended to establish penalties for rape within marriage and to broaden the legal concept of rape. The legal position of the victim of violent crime, including sexual violence, had also been improved. Other important policy instruments were research and assistance to the victims of sexual violence. A number of measures had been adopted in the areas of self-defence for young girls and women and social safety. In addition, a child abuse information campaign and an awareness-raising project on the prevention of sexual violence had also been launched.

23.     The problem of violence against women was the responsibility of various ministries. The Ministry of Welfare, Public Health and Culture saw to the care and assistance of victims of that type of violence; the Ministry of Justice was responsible for legislation on public decency; and the Ministry of Social Affairs and Employment dealt with combating sexual harassment in the workplace. The State Secretary for Social Affairs and Employment, responsible for emancipation policy, coordinated policy on violence against women. Furthermore, the Sexual Violence Working Group of the Interdepartmental Coordination Committee for Emancipation Policy coordinated such efforts at the civil service level and advised the Government on policy matters.

Article 3

24.     Since emancipation policy in the Netherlands had traditionally been the responsibility of a special State Secretary, the elimination, in 1991, of the Cabinet Committee for Emancipation Policy should not be seen as a significant event. It had, in fact, been in existence only since 1986. The office of State Secretary for Emancipation Policy had simply been reinstated.

25.     Unfortunately, the statistical summary on the position of women in the Netherlands had not been available in the English language in time for the current session, but would be published and made available to the Committee in 1994. The Woman's Social Atlas had been produced only in Dutch, and would therefore be of little use to the Committee.

26.     Responsibility for the funding of women's support centres at national, regional and provincial levels was shared out in various ways. The State Secretary for Emancipation Policy saw to it that non-governmental organizations and national support centres were financed, usually, for five-year periods, after which an evaluation was conducted to determine whether the subsidy should be prolonged, transferred or terminated. The leading principle was that the work of such bodies must continue. In some cases, national support centres had

(Ms. Swiebel, Netherlands)

found markets for their consultancy skills and other products, and were able to continue without further government subsidies. The provinces would assume the responsibility for financing the 12 provincial emancipation offices in 1994. After an initial five-year period, the decision to continue to subsidize those offices would revert to the provinces. The State Secretary for Emancipation Policy had the overall responsibility for the proper functioning of emancipation support policy on all levels of public administration.

27.     With regard to temporary special measures, the policy of the Netherlands asserted that positive action and preferential treatment measures were the domain of concerned organizations, institutions and enterprises and should be imposed by law only as a last resort. The Government had set targets to increase the number of women in all spheres of the civil service; there were, however, no sanctions when such targets were not met. Some non-governmental organizations and enterprises applied positive action measures, such as, for example, specially requesting applications from women in help wanted ads.

Article 5

28.     In the view of the Netherlands, the issue of sexual preference fell under articles 2 and 3 of the Convention; an overview of its related policies and programmes would be included in the second periodic report.

Article 6

29.     The policy of the Netherlands Government on HIV/AIDS had several thrusts: to prevent the spread of the disease, to develop a satisfactory structure for the care of people infected, to encourage scientific research, and to prevent discrimination against and stigmatization of those infected. As of 1 April 1992, the cumulative total of AIDS cases in the Netherlands had reached 2,076. An estimated 8,000 to 12,000 people were infected with HIV. Nearly 80 per cent of AIDS cases occurred among homosexual or bisexual men, and approximately 94 per cent involved intravenous drug users. The Ministry of Health, Welfare and Cultural Affairs, which, in cooperation with large number of interest groups, was responsible for implementing AIDS policy at national, regional and municipal levels, based its policy on the following principles: individual responsibility; tolerance for variant values and lifestyles; frank advice on prevention; a broad concept of safe sex; and an adequate funding level. Three committees advised the State Secretary for Health on national AIDS policy.

30.     Recently, a network of hospitals serving as AIDS centres had been set up throughout the Netherlands. In addition, in each health-care region a nursing home had been designated to coordinate the care and treatment of AIDS patients. Counselling was provided on both in-patient and out-patient bases to those

(Ms. Swiebel, Netherlands)

infected with the HIV virus. The Ministry of Health had funded a total of 66 research projects on AIDS between 1988 and 1991. The Netherlands objected to making HIV-tests part of the medical examination required of prospective employees; it also rejected such testing in the context of international travel. It had run a number of AIDS information campaigns for prostitutes.

31.     The problem faced by the Netherlands with regard to the traffic in women was forced prostitution. Illegal aliens who notified the Government that they had been subject to such treatment were granted a residence permit for the duration of the investigation and court proceedings.

32.     No link had been found between the lack of a ban on pornography and violence against women; access to pornography for adults might even temper the use of violence against women. Pornography was, of course, prohibited for persons under the age of 16. Child pornography legislation was in the process of being rewritten to make punishable not only the distribution of child pornography but also its possession.

Article 7

33.     The Netherlands was in the process of exploring means of increasing the number of women in politics and public administration. Under its political system, autonomous political parties, over which the Government was permitted to exercise no influence, put forward lists of candidates to serve in legislative bodies. The Government was therefore limited to setting standards and objectives and creating conditions conducive to the changes it sought. Its policy included, for example, furnishing grants to political parties for the purpose of increasing the number of women candidacies. Special working groups had been set up to explore issues involving the participation of women in decision-making and public life.

34.     The Netherlands Government did not support the goal of "parity democracy", which it deemed to conflict with the basic principles of democracy: in its view, to require that 50 per cent of electoral seats should be reserved for women constituted an infringement on the voting rights of citizens. Equality in political representation should be pursued through education, consultation and the setting of flexible targets by political parties.

35.     Political parties in the Netherlands registered candidate lists; position on that list, which was set by the party, determined election to a seat. Through a system of preferential votes, however, a candidate could be elected despite a low position on the list, and that could serve as a means of electing women to office. The Government granted the sum of $2.7 million a year to each political party for training, education and think-tank activities, but in the

(Ms. Swiebel, Netherlands)

interest of autonomy, parties were required to raise their own funds for overhead and for electoral activities.

36.     The 12 Queen's Commissioners, appointed by the Cabinet and approved by the Queen, tended to remain in office for long periods. Consequently, the turnover was low, and it was, in any case, difficult for the Cabinet to appoint newcomers to such posts. The goal of one woman commissioner by 1995 was therefore not insignificant.

Article 8

37.     The Ministry of Foreign Affairs had been actively endeavouring to involve women in the diplomatic service; in particular, it was attempting to increase the number of women in the upper ranks. Policy measures were geared towards the recruitment and promotion of women, and, as elsewhere in the Government, whenever possible when two candidates had equal qualifications and one of them was a woman, preferential treatment was accorded to the woman.

Article 9

38.     After ratifying the Convention on the Elimination of All Forms of Discrimination against Women, the Netherlands Government had denounced the Convention on the Nationality of Married Women, on the grounds that it contravened that instrument.

Article 11

39.     Although the employment rate for women in the Netherlands had always been low in comparison with other Western European countries, the female working population had risen from 32 per cent to 54 per cent between 1975 and 1990.

40.     The increase in the percentage of women in part-time employment could not be viewed as a manifestation of discrimination against women; many women sought part-time work because such jobs permitted them to balance their various responsibilities. A considerable number of men also sought part-time jobs; the FNV, the largest Netherlands trade union, had launched an awareness campaign to promote the notion that such an approach was a means for young fathers to achieve more integrated lives.

41.     In the Netherlands, the normal work week was 38 to 40 hours, and jobs with fewer hours were part-time. No statistics were available about the number of women working in double part-time jobs, but nor was there any indication that a substantial percentage of women combined several part-time jobs to earn a full-time salary. As a general rule, women who sought full-time jobs were able to find them.

(Ms. Swiebel, Netherlands)

42.     The Government had taken measures to address the problem of the high concentration of women in a limited range of low-skill occupations; among them were awareness campaigns for schoolgirls, expertise centres, media campaigns and the development of teaching materials. The question of equal pay for equal work was a problem in the Netherlands; the Equal Pay Act, incorporated into the revised Equal Opportunities Act, was an effort to tackle that issue. Group action had indeed proven an effective means for women to combat such situations directly. For example, the suit brought against a vocational training institute for its discriminatory quotas, described in paragraph 173 of the report, had had a successful outcome. Official 1991 statistics had cited some 13,000 cases of at-home employment, but other reports registered as many as 166,000 cases. In any event, legislation was currently being drafted to improve the situation of persons who worked at home.

43.     The General Equal Opportunities Act would at last ban all forms of discrimination in private insurance. With regard to the system of personal income tax, concern had been expressed as to the negative effect of the so-called breadwinner's benefit on women's participation in the labour market. The tax reform undertaken in the Netherlands in the early 1980s had introduced a personal allowance system that was the same for men and women. The allowance, in the sum approximately US$ 3,000, was the portion of personal income exempted from taxation; that sum doubled for a taxpayer whose partner was not employed. If, however, a non-earning partner entered the labour market, and earned an income equal to or higher than the personal allowance, the other partner would no longer be regarded as a breadwinner, and would lose his double allowance. A woman entering the labour market on a part-time basis at a low hourly income rate might be discouraged from seeking work as a consequence of that policy. From a socio-economic angle, it was uncertain, however, whether that system functioned as a disincentive to all women, or only to a narrow group of women.

44.     Women who experienced discrimination in the workplace could invoke article 11 of the Convention when bringing action against the State but not against an employer or another citizen. Ultimately, however, that distinction was of little importance in the Netherlands, because both the Equal Opportunities Act and the forthcoming General Equal Opportunities Act afforded women many grounds on which to seek legal redress.

45.     The next report would include a more substantial analysis with regard to article 11, with particular attention paid to the socio-economic position of women. It would also address the question of policies concerning female agricultural workers.

(Ms. Swiebel, Netherlands)

Article 12

46.     A study would be conducted in 1994 on access by women to health services. There were increasing numbers of women among the new AIDS cases. The average age of women with AIDS was lower than that of men. All relevant government programmes were accessible to both men and women; there were no programmes especially for women. Aware, however, of the importance of the issue for women, the Netherlands Government had instituted a women-and-AIDS office; it had also created a division for women within the Netherlands HIV association, which had set up a national network to foster self-help groups.

47.     The drug policy of the Netherlands aimed at restricting in so far as possible the risks posed by drug abuse both to users themselves and to society. The approach was based on the principle that only cohesive, balanced and multidisciplinary measures could control the drug problem. Little specific information was available relating to drug abuse and women; the ratio of female to male addicts was approximately one to three.

48.     Although artificial insemination was not regulated by law, hospitals and other institutions had protocols governing the performance of such procedures. Most importantly, a woman applicant could not be refused access on the basis of marital status, sexual preference or lifestyle; if, however, a physician had moral objections in a given case, he was permitted to refer a patient to a colleague.

49.     There were currently no laws governing pregnancy at an advanced age. On the initiative of the United Kingdom, a working group within the European Union would shortly commence discussions on that matter.

Article 16

50.     The Netherlands Parliament was in the process of considering a bill on sexual equality in the choice of names, by which both sexes would, for example, have the right to keep the family name, assume a spouse's name, or place a spouse's name before the family name.

51.     Since the enactment in 1991 of new legislation on rape within marriage, several court cases had arisen, most involving spouses that were separated but not divorced. In the view of the Netherlands, substituting the words "against the will" for the words "through force" would not be a beneficial development, because such a formulation could allow the rape victim to be questioned about her attitudes. As the legislation stood, the prosecution simply had to demonstrate that force or any other form of compulsion had been used.

(Ms. Swiebel, Netherlands)

52.     The mandatory five-day pre-abortion waiting period had been devised to encourage women to reconsider terminating a pregnancy. Furthermore, there were plans to incorporate more rigorous requirements into the Termination of Pregnancy Act, so as to guarantee that every such decision was cautiously made. Abortions were permitted on medical and social grounds during the first 20 weeks of pregnancy and had to be performed by a physician in a hospital or clinic especially licensed to carry out such operations.

53.     The CHAIRPERSON said that, while surprised by the position of the Netherlands Government on parity democracy, which the European women's movement had been working so hard to achieve, she felt that its views could provide a valuable basis for reflection.

54.     In the current world-wide economic crisis, part-time work might be an interesting and creative solution to the problem of working time: the approach of the Netherlands might indeed be more advanced than that of other countries.

55.     She thanked the representatives of the Netherlands for their replies, noting that she had been particularly impressed by the explanation of the role of the Government and non-governmental organizations.

56.     Ms. GARCIA-PRINCE expressed the hope that members of the Committee could be provided with copies of the replies provided by the Netherlands delegation. Noting that the Netherlands was doing a splendid job in its cooperation programmes with developing countries, particularly in the area of the advancement of women, she said that it would seem that certain countries such as her own, Venezuela, were deemed not to be in need of help. That was not necessarily true.

57.     Ms. BRAVO de RAMSEY commended the Netherlands representative for the wonderful way in which her Government was dealing with the full integration of women into national life, adding that she would welcome more information on the moral objections of medical practitioners to artificial insemination.

58.     Ms. SWIEBEL (Netherlands) noted, concerning international cooperation, that her country undertook such cooperation in the context, for example, of the Commission on the Status of Women, where an ongoing dialogue was carried on to determine how women in Government and non-governmental organizations from all countries of the world could work together to produce better results. It was also involved in the area of development cooperation, where concepts such as the women and development policy, had to be placed in the context of a country's overall development cooperation policy. That might force Governments to adopt a selective approach. While she was not in a position to comment further on Venezuela's specific situation she would take due note of the concern expressed.

(Ms. Swiebel, Netherlands)

59.     Concerning artificial insemination, it must be borne in mind that in a country like hers there were different views on what constituted morality. Under the code of conduct she had referred to, individual physicians could object to performing that procedure simply because they had a different view on the issue, but were obliged to refer women to another institution or colleague.

60.     Ms. ABAKA, noting that the Netherlands was one of the few countries that had passed a law on the issue, wondered whether the Netherlands representative could tell the Committee about some experiences concerning euthanasia.

61.     Ms. SWIEBEL (Netherlands) said that her delegation had decided that linking the women's issue with euthanasia would be dangerous because it would give the impression that decisions concerning the fate of relatives would have to be taken primarily by women. Moreover, the issue was a highly complex and politically sensitive one and it would be unwise to improvise any formal statement. However, she would be happy to supply a formal letter of the Netherlands Government stating its policy on the issue.

62.     Ms. Swiebel, Ms. Bode-Olton and Ms. Hoevertsz (Netherlands) withdrew.

63.     At the invitation of the Chairperson, Ms. Bernard (Guyana) took a place at the Committee table.